Although Dr. Ruth’s name may be known by millions of people, those “in the know” – and we are in the know — consider, Dr. Marty Klien, to be just about the last word in the field of sex therapy. Author of “Your Sexual Secrets” (published by Dutton), and, more recently “Ask Me Anything: A Sex Therapist Answers the Most Important Questions for the ’90s” (published by Fireside/Simon & Schuster), Marty Klein has been a consistent voice of sanity and good sense in a sometimes, well, flakey field.
You may have read one of his many articles and columns in magazines such as Playboy, New Woman, Men’s Journal, Modern Bride, The New Physician, and others.
We were lucky, to get a chance to speak with Dr. Klein recently, when he visited Los Angeles, to speak at a professional conference of psychologists. What follows is our free-wheeling interview:
1. Your new book is called “Ask Me Anything.” Can we ask you anything?
Klein: Of course.
2. For starters, what exactly does a sex therapist do?
Klein: A sex therapist is someone with a background in psychology and sexology. We treat sexual difficulties of all kinds in men, women, and couples.
3. What do you mean by “sexual difficulties”?
Klein: Generally, problems with erection, orgasm, desire, fantasy or gender dysforia.
4. So you have the same skills as regular therapist, with a specialization in sexual issues?
Klein: Correct – at least, ideally.
5. Do you have sex with your patients?
Klein: That’s strictly forbidden. But the reason most therapists don’t have sex with their patients is not because it’s forbidden – it’s because it’s bad therapy.
6. But what about sex surrogate therapy? Most people think that’s what sex therapy is.
Klein: Sex surrogates are specially trained. They also have backgrounds in
psychology and sexology. It’s very specialized. They take the role of a partner if no partner is available. It’s not just about sex. They help patients who have problems with social skills, they help people to gain comfort in talking about sex and with issues such as fears about sex.
7. How is this different from prostitution?
Klein: The specialized training and the fact that everything a surrogate does is goal oriented. A surrogate will only engage in activities that are central to therapy goals. So in certain cases a surrogate wouldn’t have sex with the patient at all, but would stand in for a partner in other respects.
8. What is normal sexual behavior?
Klein:”Normal” has many definitions. First, there’s statistically normal. In this respect, having blue eyes is not normal. Then there’s morally normal. So, for many people, pre-marital sex is not normal, although it may be normal in a statistical sense. Then there’s medical normality, or the way some organ or tissue should function. So a medical person might think it’s normal that a man should be able to get an erection the day after his wife died. Now, a psychologist might not agree, so there’s psychological normality, also. Then there are societal views of normal, so a person who finds a 16 year old attractive might not be considered normal by the public in general, whereas a psychologist or sexologist or anthropologist might or might not agree with that.
9. What if someone comes to you and is upset because they’re worried that their sexuality is not moral and they want to change it?
Klein: That’s a perfectly reasonable goal. However, my main goal as a therapist is to help people to become comfortable with who they really are as people and sexual beings.
10. Do you believe in the idea of perversion or paraphilia- that certain sexual behaviors are actually diseases?
Klein: I believe in perversion as a statistical term. Some behaviors are statistically unusual, but i don’t find perversion or paraphilia a helpful term because it implies a moral judgment.
11. Why is it useful to keep moral judgments out? What about people who get turned on by rape or other crime?
Klein: I don’t keep moral judgments out of my work – I just make sure that I distinguish between moral and therapeutic judgments. I make it clear if a moral or ethical judgment is being made. I don’t hide that behind therapeutic jargon or confuse judgments with fact. I certainly want to support people in behaving morally and ethically but we need to make sure people understand the difference between ethical judgments, medical or psychological facts, simple opinion, and so on.
12. What’s the most common complaint you get from men coming to see you alone?
Klein: Coming more quickly than they would like.
13. You mean premature ejaculation?
Klein: No, I mean coming more quickly than they would like.
14. What’s the…oh, I get it – there’s that value judgment being placed when you call it “premature ejaculation.”
Klein: Exactly. There may be nothing wrong with the man at all except that he’s been watching too many Peter North movies and expects to be able to do the same thing.
15. What about women coming to see you. What are their most common complaints?
Klein: The man coming more quickly than they would like. (Laughter). Actually, I guess it would be not being happy with the sexual choices they keep making.
16. So for females it’s more in the psychological realm.
Klein: Yeah.
17. Our impression from the letters we receive agrees with your experience that premature ejaculation is perceived as a big problem by many men, but our readers also seem to be obsessed with the size of their penises. It seems to me that there’s a myth springing up that’s supplanting a previous mythology. The old mythology was that size was the most important thing, and now there’s this new idea that “it’s not the size, it’s what you do with it.” Is that true, or is that also a myth?
Klein: Some women care about size, some women don’t, it’s that simple. For different women different things matter, just like for different men different things matter. Some men will say that the size of vagina is key, some men don’t care. They may say, sure, a tight vagina is nice, but the important thing is the enthusiasm of woman or her willingness to give head. Believe me, those things are a lot more important to many men.
18. So you don’t think there’s any pattern at all for women relative to the size of a man’s penis?
Klein: Yes, there is a pattern and it’s just as I said – some women care, some women don’t. For some women sensual skills, tenderness, going down on her, all of that truly is important to women.
19. I hate to keep going with this, but what if all else were equal? I mean, there are two men, each is equally tender, sensitive, and skilled in kissing and caressing or whatever…but one is big and one isn’t.
Klein: I still say that even, if all else were equal, some women care and some women don’t; but many don’t care (At this point our female companion, who had been listening to all of the above with amusement, piped up).
Our Female Companion: I care. (Laughter). Doesn’t anyone want to hear my opinion?
Klein: Of course we do. But you don’t speak for all women. (more laughter).
Our Female Companion: I think, if the penis is anywhere within average range, it probably doesn’t matter much to most women. But if the penis is way below average (under 4 inches), or way above average (over10 inches), it does matter. I don’t know anyone who likes being f**#8 by a battering ram or by a rabbit’s penis.
20. Okay. So women aren’t just being nice to you when they say that size doesn’t matter that much or at all?
Klein: If I were the average guy on the street, I would 100% believe a woman if she says that size is NOT the most important thing.